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[00:00:00] Welcome back to the retail initiative podcast. I am excited for today. Um, I have one of my favorite clients that I think we've ever had. She's come to my workshop that I do with Tara Austin. She's been in my world and gosh, an amazing retailer that I think you're going to be able to take away some awesome things that you can apply to your business.
[00:00:22] And also leave us some inspiration around what's possible for you and your brand. So Bryson, thank you for being here. Thank you, [00:00:30] Josh. That's quite the introduction. Thanks for having me. Oh, I didn't even say your store. So she's with Clover and B. That's right. Yes, and they're in Birmingham, Alabama. It's funny.
[00:00:39] You're actually my set. Oh, no, the last one was Georgia. I'm just doing all southern Um, I just did an episode of Jensey Wallace from Jensey's Yeah. Yeah. So we're just hitting the South. Um. It's a great place, Josh. I love it. Well, let's get into it. So you've been in business a while, so you've seen a lot of [00:01:00] things.
[00:01:00] Um, so tell me about like when you first got started, like when did you start and where did you get this idea from? Well, I actually come from an entrepreneurial family. So let me just say, I think it's been in my blood since I was born. We played store as kids. I remember that vividly. Um, but went to college and was in communications and public relations and didn't really know how that would play out in my life.
[00:01:24] But I also. Worked in boutiques, all of high school and all of college. And I [00:01:30] really learned so much about inventory, about managing a boutique. How do you attract a customer? How do you price those kinds of things? And I loved learning that. And I knew that was something I was passionate about. So. When I graduated from college, did a few jobs, um, obviously did not have the money to open my own business, but had the dream.
[00:01:49] It was there. And then about five years after college, my, I have two sisters, we were all in the same city. We all had the dream of opening a store together. So we went to my [00:02:00] dad and we just said, Hey, could we have, if there is inheritance money, could we have some of it to try to open? We, we did have a business plan.
[00:02:08] I look back now and it was more of a pipe dream. I'm super glad my dad wasn't like an actual investor who was looking to see where the money would be made. Looking back now, I laugh at that part, but at least we tried, we tried with the business plan. So he agreed to give us money to open the store. And so we did, we opened a children's clothing store that was in [00:02:30] 2007.
[00:02:31] So 2006, one of those years, long time ago, um, it was something that we were all passionate about. I had two children at that point. So it was an area that I was living in. Um, so we opened the store and then literally six months later, because we were a children's store, we saw a lot of pregnant women come in and we realized that there was a.
[00:02:50] Big hole in the market for maternity clothes that were actually cute and trendy and not that old school moo moo. Like, [00:03:00] um, and I just had my, my son and I felt the same way. I just like, I cannot find any clothes that I feel like. I'm still cute, but that accommodate a belly. So we actually opened a second store called the Swanky Stork.
[00:03:15] Um, and that is actually what Clover and Bee is today. We have changed and transformed over the years as the economy has forced us to, or as the customer has made us, but. Basically, that is what you see today. Our children's [00:03:30] store, we ended up closing that. We dabbled in wholesale and, um, my other two sisters got out of the business.
[00:03:35] So we closed that, but I kept maternity store. It's now women's clothing and clover and bee today. So tell me that evolution, like when did you make the decision? Cause I also don't see maternity stuff. We haven't really talked about that as we're working together. Where did that transition happen? Cause I do think a lot of retailers.
[00:03:55] You know, they start as one thing and like, I hear a [00:04:00] lot, I see a lot of like home businesses, for example, get into home and then they add boutique in and then boutique really takes off and they're like, Oh, let's just, do we keep home? What do we do with that? Where did you make that transition and what did that look like?
[00:04:14] Yeah, I think there's two really key, important things with retail. One, you have to always be listening to your customer and evolving, staying true to your brand, but evolving with your customer, as long as it's still true to who you are. Um, but second, I think you have to see where your passions [00:04:30] are. And my children are now, I have, they're in college, they're teenagers.
[00:04:34] So I'm clearly out of the maternity industry as well. And so that's part of the story, but as. As we were in the maternity business, we started seeing moms that would come back to us after they have babies. And they would say, kind of like my maternity story, I don't know where to shop because I feel like my body's different, my lifestyle's different.
[00:04:52] What I, my needs for style are different, but there's nowhere to shop. There are a million cute boutiques that are catering [00:05:00] to young college, young twenties, you know. Cute bodies, not my body anymore. And so they would come in and so we, we started seeing that need and we created what we called a beyond the bump section in our store.
[00:05:15] And it was just, they were not maternity, but they were things that worked for a body after maternity. And it took off. I mean, it was crazy. It took off, but it was funny because no stork, if they're not [00:05:30] pregnant. They would literally walk in and be like, I'm not pregnant. And I'm like, you can't get pregnant walking in here.
[00:05:35] It's okay. It's like, you can come in. It reminds me of my sister in law on Thanksgiving because she gets bugged so much, but I didn't even have a kid when she walks in and she's like, I'm not pregnant, just don't ask. Yeah. It was like, we almost, we really almost created bags that said, I'm not pregnant. I just love the clothes or something like that.
[00:05:53] But so, um, But we really were like, okay, we're seeing this growth in this area, but we're seeing that our [00:06:00] name and being a quote, maternity boutique is really hindering us. So we were like, okay, what if we transition and we say, you know, we're going to be both. Um, and we had also brought in bedding at that time, baby bedding that we were creating and producing, and it was doing really well.
[00:06:14] So we evolved to cradle and be. And the idea was cradle with the bedding and maternity, but B is our queen bee moms. So we took out the word maternity, um, we moved to a bigger location and again, just saw growth. [00:06:30] Um, and then after about three years of that, we, we saw in COVID as well, COVID just tanked the maternity industry.
[00:06:37] I mean, really tanked it. Um, it was, it was. Scary. I was so thankful that we had actually made that transition and all of our eggs were not in the maternity basket, but covid tank, the maternity industry. And then we just saw our customer base really grow more in that mom and less in the maternity significantly.
[00:06:56] And we were doing so well with the mom section that we needed even the [00:07:00] retail floor space that our bedding was taking up. To add more into that section. So we eventually after COVID, we were like, okay, our customer base has really evolved into this young mom. Just kind of a I would say not not even after bump anymore So we took out maternity and we took out bedding, but then people were still confused by the name cradle Cause it's still kind of lended itself to kids and baby.
[00:07:27] So we were like, Oh my goodness. Okay. We'll rebrand [00:07:30] again. And, but we wanted to keep all the colors and even the C and B a lot. We got known as C plus B. So we were like, what's a fun C name? So we came up with word clover and we're like, okay, this is good. We can play on luck. You know, we can play our colors worked.
[00:07:44] So we became clover and B and it has been awesome. And Josh, that is the last time I'm rebranding or changing my name. I get it. We did that earlier this year and I'd never want to do it again. Um, okay. So one, I have a [00:08:00] huge takeaway from what you just shared. And then I have a follow up question for you.
[00:08:03] So one is a big takeaway and it's something I've been thinking about a lot. Cause I mean, I'm talking to multiple retailers every single day. And one of the things that I think we tend to do is we get stuck in an identity of like, we're this store, like, this is what we are. And we think that like the idea of that identity shifting is like impossible.
[00:08:27] You're like, people are going to be confused. They're never going to [00:08:30] know. Like for me, I used to be the point of sale guy. Like that was my market. That was my thing. And I was the point of sale guy. And what's funny is. Like, no one even knows that now. And I felt so tied to it. And I was like, I hate this world.
[00:08:44] Like, I could never do it. And made that shift and here we are. Most people don't even know that that's my background unless I bring it up. And I love that you, without fear, I'm sure there's some fear in it, we're [00:09:00] able to make that evolution and kind of shift that identity. And so for those of you listening, if you are in something that you're like, I just don't love this anymore, know that there is an other side to it where you can make that identity shift without fear and the market will adjust.
[00:09:18] You'll gain, you'll lose some customers and you're going to gain new ones. And there's going to be that great middle group that just stays loyal with you in that identity shift. But my follow up question was something you said about listening to your customer. [00:09:30] Cause this is one that I always see to be really challenging of like, how do you balance that tension of people come in like, I wish you carried this and I wish you carried this, I wish you carried it.
[00:09:39] And you're like, okay, like go get it. And then doesn't move. We listened to our customer and it was really bad advice. But on the other hand, do you need to listen to our customer? Like, what does that look like for you to not like be a wishlist store where they say it, you go get it. But also you kind of [00:10:00] keep your ear to the ground on what they're doing.
[00:10:01] What does that look like for you? I will say, I think we're the best at doing that now than we ever have been. And that's a lot because of being at manifest and working with momentum and really, you know, you say, who is your ideal customer? And we actually, we've named her, she's Clover. We know who Clover is.
[00:10:17] And, um, and I think that is critical. First of all, who is your ideal customer? And, and for me, it's not that. But it's who do I know that if this person walks in the door, [00:10:30] she's going to find exactly what she needs. I know her. I get her. There are young, cute 20 year olds that I think are amazing and I wish I looked just like them.
[00:10:39] They say words I don't understand. They use phrases that I'm like, is that? What is coming out of your mouth right now? You know, those kinds of things. And so for one, the very first thing I would say is what you guys have taught us is who is your ideal customer? Who can you serve the very, very best without even, it's not even feel like work, it's like, [00:11:00] this is how I am.
[00:11:01] This is, this is who I am. Um, the second thing that we do that I really like is we will very frequently, I would say once a quarter, I'd like to do it more. I don't want to get weird about it, but we put up in stories. A series of questions. We just say what are we doing great right now? Where do we need to improve right now?
[00:11:20] What do you wish we did differently? Um, you know, we'll put those kind of questions up and it's just a question box on instagram So people can respond obviously anonymously I mean [00:11:30] it's not out there for everyone on instagram to see And we get excellent feedback and it has been such a way to For me to stay in check, there are times that I can see I'm leaning too much toward these younger trends because it's enticing.
[00:11:44] I'm like, Oh, every boutique out there is blowing this cute little mini skirt out. And, and then my, my customer base will say, Hey, remember, you know, remember us moms or remember us and they're really sweet about it. And then I have to kind of get back and check and say, [00:12:00] you know what? That's right. That is such a cute outfit.
[00:12:02] It's not Clover. It's not our girl. And, um, and so I think just that's a way that we listen and we stay in check, but you have to be willing to listen to hear too. Sometimes people just get mad and, and I'm like, no, this is great. I appreciate that our customers are willing to give us feedback. We listen to it.
[00:12:20] We adjust as we need, but we also knew. This is who we serve, and this is who we don't, we can't serve well. I love that. So [00:12:30] you, when you started, like you weren't online when you first launched, right? Correct. And how long? That was, online wasn't even like really a thing. Maybe sorta, but not really. Yeah, it, well, so you, but it was a thing before you launched.
[00:12:47] Yeah. What was it, like you could have launched earlier if you had wanted to. It kind of made you wait and that's not a bad thing. I actually love that you waited. [00:13:00] What was it that made you first? What is it that made you wait? And then what was the thing that we're like, all right, we're doing this. Yeah.
[00:13:08] Well, I think two things. One, when it was a thing, when we launched, you're right. But it was a very, very expensive thing. So if you were going to do it, you're working with a web designer. I mean. As much as it cost me to basically open my store. And so obviously financially we were not in that position, but to my motto has always been, if I'm going to do something, I want to do it.
[00:13:26] Well, I want to be ready to do it. Well, not just, [00:13:30] this is a great idea in my head. So whether that's financially a plan, um, so. That was always in the back of our mind, but when the recession hit that for me is when we in 08, that's when we really had to look and say, okay, where do we have to make some major adjustments?
[00:13:46] And we looked at our price point. That was one. Um, and we got into a whole other price point that we'd never been in that we're still in to this day, a more moderate price point. Um, but also we started looking at online and what are some ways that we can reach beyond [00:14:00] just. Right here in Birmingham, Alabama.
[00:14:02] So we can increase sales across the nation. Um, and then other places like Shopify come out where there's these ready made websites that, you know, very affordable. So at that point we felt like, okay, we can do this. Well, this is an area we can start dipping our toe in. We're not spending tons and tons of money, but we can figure it out.
[00:14:22] So that for me was. The desire to grow beyond just local customers and also do it in a way that was [00:14:30] affordable and looked good without having to go pay a super expensive web designer. And, and when you did finally do this, like, did it take off pretty quickly? Was it a really slow build? What did that look like right after you launched?
[00:14:43] Very slow, very disappointing, very like, where is everybody? And again, social media wasn't really a thing then, you know, so trying to promote it was really hard because you're, you're basically promoting it to your local customers who are just coming in the store anyway. [00:15:00] So I think for us, it took, it took a long time, a long time for that to really work.
[00:15:07] And for us to figure out that. Actually, that's a whole separate customer. I think we were still trying to target our local customer and instead of realizing, Hey, this is a national customer now, you know, what does that person want? What are they looking for? Um, analyzing their buying habits in addition to the buying habits in the store.
[00:15:27] Yeah. A lot of times I love to see it as. [00:15:30] Your perfect local customer, it's clones or twins all around the country. And that kind of, at least it pulls you up. Like actually I had a coaching call yesterday where they, all of their posts, this client's posts were like very local based. It was about local events.
[00:15:47] And so it was like, Hey, this is the perfect dress for, you know, the main street parade, or why did it go to parade? But it's the perfect dress for this one [00:16:00] local event. And I'm like, Hey. There are Events that are universal across America through this season. What if instead of just referencing that you reference this and you can kind of do both, but yes, no, that's perfect.
[00:16:16] But so when you look back and you didn't gain traction early on. Is there something you're like, I wish I could go back and tell myself, like, I don't love to look back with regrets, but I do love to learn from that piece. Is there something you'd go [00:16:30] back and tell yourself that maybe would have changed the trajectory earlier on?
[00:16:36] Oh, absolutely. Well, first of all, just even what you guys have taught us. To think like a brand and not just a storefront. So what I was referencing, I think we just thought like a storefront. And so this was just an extension of our store and really, honestly, until we just worked with you guys this year in Momentum, I, and at Manifest, I have.
[00:16:58] Really continue to have that [00:17:00] mindset, but I've had tools like social media and things to help me get the word out there, but we still never saw the growth that we wanted to see. And so I would definitely look back and say, okay, this almost treated like a different store. Like you said, a clone or a sister.
[00:17:17] We still know who we are. We still know who our customer is, but how do we, how is this? An extension of our brand. How do we use this as just another selling arm of our brand? Um, and that for me, that has been the [00:17:30] biggest game changer for us after coming out of manifest and totally rethinking every post we make, every photo we take, every image we put up, every description we write, is this central to our brand and does it reach this selling arm and this selling, you know, the storefront is a selling arm.
[00:17:48] The social media is a selling arm. The website's a selling arm. I would absolutely go back and dump all that knowledge into her all these years ago. I love that. And for those of you that are, uh, [00:18:00] new to my world or haven't heard that, what she's referencing is this framework that I teach in pretty much every webinar that I do is this idea of going from like seeing yourself as a store that launches a website that launches an Instagram that does events or.
[00:18:14] Whatever. And everything really is around the storefront. And so your store launches a site and you see a lot of stuff about the store. Instead, starting to see yourself as a brand that is obsessed with this perfect customer and how does the brand help them no matter where they're engaged. And [00:18:30] so when you start to think about it that way, you start to think about what is the brand experience.
[00:18:35] That plays itself out through an in store experience, it plays itself out through an online experience, the social media experience. But it's about the brand and the customer first, and then the channels just come from that, rather than being about the store experience. And saying, okay, how do we take the store experience online?
[00:18:54] It's not really that, it's how do we translate the store experience. Into a brain experience. So that's the, [00:19:00] the background. It's so good. It's so good. It changes everything. I love that. And so now, you know, this has started, this has started to gain traction and you have an incredible team that you've put around you.
[00:19:14] And so I don't want to make people at home think like this is just solo show over here. You have that incredible team. Things are starting to work for you now. And let's be real like 2023. It was a weird year. I don't want to say hard, but it was [00:19:30] even brands that are growing. I would say it was the hardest year to grow in and it was challenging.
[00:19:37] Yes. What has helped you this year in overcoming some of that? Like what's really working for you? And moving the brand forward, despite all the circumstances that could hold you back. Yeah, I think that's a great question. 2023 has been so weird, especially coming out of 2022 when everybody's just buying everything all the time, you know?
[00:19:59] So [00:20:00] I think again, not to beat a dead horse, but for us, for 2023, it does make you stop and go, okay, why am I doing this? What am I trying to accomplish here? And. Coming out of manifest and it really gave us a game plan and a true understanding of who we are and we stick to that. And so in years where it's harder, we're not spending money on wasted things that this isn't really actually our customer, or this isn't really who we are as a brand.
[00:20:29] And on the flip [00:20:30] side, we are investing in things that like you guys are building a website for us. And we said, Hey, this is worth our money because we get it now in this new website is going to reach our customer and project our brand voice in a perfect way. That's worth putting my money into. So I think it's helped us make financial decisions.
[00:20:49] Um, but then also even. Be more intentional about listening to our customer and understanding our customer more. And when you do that, they, they feel that and they appreciate [00:21:00] that because I think what, there are so many cute boutiques around me, why are they coming to me instead of the other, you know, million boutiques around the world that they could go to, what sets me apart and how do I make sure that we're projecting that and everything that we do?
[00:21:15] So I think we have found a purpose in our business and. What we do comes across authentically because it is coming from who we are. And so that keeps customers coming back. Um, and like you said, I don't have every cut, a lot of customers come [00:21:30] in and we're not them and that's okay. Being okay to let them leave and say, we're, you know, we can't serve you.
[00:21:35] Well, that's great. That's okay. Um, so I think that, I hope that's a good way of answering your question. Just as 2023 and as hard years come, you tend to, your brain just. Almost tends to just grasp at straws and you end up wasting a lot of money. And I think for us understanding who we are working with, you guys said, okay, here's how we can invest well and also reach our customer well, which keeps them coming back and choosing us over plenty of other [00:22:00] great options out there.
[00:22:01] Yeah. No, I love that. One of the things that I have noticed, one of the things that I have noticed is like the, as we go through this journey as a CEO, as an entrepreneur, personally, like, I don't just mean as our revenue grows, like the personal journey. And I asked those what's working questions. The further along someone is in that journey, not by age, but really just the development of themselves as [00:22:30] a CEO, the more based on principles, the more based on strategy, those answers tend to be like, you didn't answer that with like, Oh, it's Facebook ads or, Oh, it's Instagram or, Oh.
[00:22:42] It's that where early on, it's a lot of like, what's working. I'll tell you what's working. Like subject lines with emojis. Like that's been crushing it. But I will say for people that are earlier on, they tend to be hungry for tactics. Like, is there some, is there something right now that you're like, you [00:23:00] know, we've been doing this and it has been awesome for us because your strategy, which for those of you that are earlier in your journey.
[00:23:07] Don't read, go past that and think like, okay, that doesn't apply to me. That very much is tends to be the thing that will fuel the growth that you're after. Yeah, but tactics are fun sometimes is, is there something that has been really working for you lately that you've been working through? What's funny.
[00:23:27] It seems we have honed in on [00:23:30] imperfection, um, because I think about, okay, Clover, my client. She is usually a mom, not always a mom. She is crazy busy. She may or may not have brushed her teeth in the morning, but her kids are out of school. They did eat, they have lunches, you know, whatever. So we laugh about as we've honed in on our customer, her life is so imperfect, but she wants it to look perfect.
[00:23:52] And so we have really honed in even just speaking of tactics, like social media, some of just the. [00:24:00] Imperfections that even, even like the outtakes with our models or laughing at, we did a reel called what kind of elf on the shelf mom are you? And it was awesome. Like it was so funny. Just the different, the annoyingly prepared mom, the.
[00:24:15] Oh, crap, mom, that blame your kids, mom. Well, you, you must've done something cause the elf didn't move, you know? And like, so for us, we've just seen a lot of engagement, um, with just meeting her where she is and, and really like leaning [00:24:30] into imperfections of life and saying, Hey, this is what life's about.
[00:24:33] It's beautiful. And we celebrate it. I love that. You know, it's funny. I, when I, I teach a lot, like when you do social to do like inspirational content, educational content, entertaining content. And when you marry that with like a really deep understanding, and when I say deep, I mean like, you know the deepest insecurities that your customer has.
[00:24:57] What's funny is when you can marry those insecurities with [00:25:00] entertaining content. Yeah. And you, like, it's an insecurity of like, I'm not a good mom. And I know that I'm not a good mom because of, like, I can't even do an elf on the shelf. Like, come on. I just have to move the thing every night. Yeah. But it's funny.
[00:25:13] And that causes, like, when you can put humor to the things that they're feeling deep down. Like that brand loyalty is awesome. So I love that you're like, I, seeing that applied is so cool and you're doing such a great job. Um, well, I [00:25:30] am so grateful for you being here. I hope for those of you listening, that this was a helpful episode and you leave us some inspiration to kind of shift your beliefs around your brand and what it could look like to not just be a store, but be a brand that serves.
[00:25:43] So thank you for being here. Thanks for having me, Josh. I forgot to mention you have a podcast. I do. Yes. It's part of our brand voice that you've taught me. Um, but yeah, it's called honey for your heart. And we just take the [00:26:00] stories that we encounter with our customers and we share them and we just create this sisterhood kind of leaning into the imperfection thing.
[00:26:07] Hey, you are not alone in all the things that you're dealing with. So it's been, um, been a fun thing, honey, for your heart. I love that. So make sure you check that out. Check out her store, Google clover and be boutique. You will find it. We'll also put a link in the show notes to check them out. They're an incredible business and definitely listen to her podcast.
[00:26:27] If that sounds like if that's you and you kind of want to hear those [00:26:30] imperfect stories, it's a great place. Hopefully https: otter. ai Parts of my story that I don't typically get into. And so, um, again, thank you for being here. And for those of you listening, I can't wait to see you next week.
